Is there such a thing as excessive nerfing?

[george.felix]

If the co driver would watch his mirror like he is supposed to, you would not have this problem if the slower guys ego will allow him to actually pull over for the guy who on time is already ahead of him. Other wise the guy who would not get out of the way is going to get rammed and complain on FB how some other team tried to Kill them. Get over your self and get out of the way. #Truestory.

I disagree that a co driver not looking in his mirror justifies destroying the car it just doesn't balance. The rules don't say anything about looking in your mirrors but they are explicit that nerfing is not allowed and can get you DQ'd so I'd be ok with it if you can get Casey to change the rules so they say nerfing is allowed. Is there something wrong with changing the rules to make it legal so were all on the same page with this. I'll strap a set of Texas Longhorns on the front and let's go at it....FYI I don't believe Nygren was slow by any means he was running better than 44 mph pace in 5 the place

F. Minor nerfing: One position.
G. Major nerfing: Disqualification

 

[rupert14]

If you are not in it to win it, get out of the way, every time. I raced and won the 2012 unlimited utv championship in BITD in my DSR1. It was fast as we were the overall fastest at the parker race that year. I quickly locked up the championship. We kept a keen eye on the mirror as our class started in front and we knew we would not be pushing as hard as some of the pro class. I went a WHOLE season without any bump at all. How did I do it, watch the mirror and if someone is charging hard, pull over, even if it means waiting 10 seconds for them to pass. You did well on your own right but you know the big $$ is in the pro class. Know the starting order, know where the fast cars are, look at them, be aware of who should be charging, and let's all have a fun SAFE race. I only hit one person hard, and they did not pull over after three bumps, and the whole rear bumper/spare tire carrier were replaced before the next race. Damage does happen but it is as much the responsibility of the Co driver to inform the driver to pull over as it is for the driver to avoid heavy contact if possable. If a car has any issues at all, that is even more reason to watch the mirror close. No one wants to have to pull over, but is that better than going home on a trailer? On occasion it is hard to see them coming in the dust but 99% of the time you can see them before they get to you.

BITD is no place for medically compromised or frail people. That will only shut the sport down for all of us. My boys are now starting to race and we are going to AZOP where taking it easy is safe. Best of luck to all and welcome to the big leagues.

 

[COGNITO]

If you are not in it to win it, get out of the way, every time. I raced and won the 2012 unlimited utv championship in BITD in my DSR1. It was fast as we were the overall fastest at the parker race that year. I quickly locked up the championship. We kept a keen eye on the mirror as our class started in front and we knew we would not be pushing as hard as some of the pro class. I went a WHOLE season without any bump at all. How did I do it, watch the mirror and if someone is charging hard, pull over, even if it means waiting 10 seconds for them to pass. You did well on your own right but you know the big $$ is in the pro class. Know the starting order, know where the fast cars are, look at them, be aware of who should be charging, and let's all have a fun SAFE race. I only hit one person hard, and they did not pull over after three bumps, and the whole rear bumper/spare tire carrier were replaced before the next race. Damage does happen but it is as much the responsibility of the Co driver to inform the driver to pull over as it is for the driver to avoid heavy contact if possable. If a car has any issues at all, that is even more reason to watch the mirror close. No one wants to have to pull over, but is that better than going home on a trailer? On occasion it is hard to see them coming in the dust but 99% of the time you can see them before they get to you.

BITD is no place for medically compromised or frail people. That will only shut the sport down for all of us. My boys are now starting to race and we are going to AZOP where taking it easy is safe. Best of luck to all and welcome to the big leagues.

Well said

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[ironworks]

Couldn't been that fast if Cognito, Is not even in the top 15 at this point and was it 60 miles later he is trying to get by.


I have not been racing BITD long and will tell you there are people out there that will just flat not get over. I tried to be nice for a while and ride along with them. At Parker this year we chased the Murrays for like 20 miles and some other dumb ass in a camo 2 seater that hit everything but the pace car trying to keep the cars that caught him behind them and eventually lost a wheel hanging it out on the flat graded road. He blocked my pass on the outside 3 times intentionally before we saw his right rear wheel wobbling and my co driver pointed out that deal looks like its gonna take wings and fly and sure enough Karma caught him at 80mph on the winding graded road.

There is zero excuse for a Co driver to not know that some one is back there with or without the other persons siren. All you have to look for is thick dust on the horizon behind you. Its obvious if its your own dust or some one elses and as soon as you see some one else dust you should be ready to pull over and get out of the faster cars way.

 

[george.felix]

Couldn't been that fast if Cognito, Is not even in the top 15 at this point and was it 60 miles later he is trying to get by.


I have not been racing BITD long and will tell you there are people out there that will just flat not get over. I tried to be nice for a while and ride along with them. At Parker this year we chased the Murrays for like 20 miles and some other dumb ass in a camo 2 seater that hit everything but the pace car trying to keep the cars that caught him behind them and eventually lost a wheel hanging it out on the flat graded road. He blocked my pass on the outside 3 times intentionally before we saw his right rear wheel wobbling and my co driver pointed out that deal looks like its gonna take wings and fly and sure enough Karma caught him at 80mph on the winding graded road.

There is zero excuse for a Co driver to not know that some one is back there with our without the other persons siren. All you have to look for is thick dust on the horizon behind you. Its obvious if its your own dust or some one else and as soon as you see some one else dust you should be ready to pull over and get out of the faster cars way.

So what car you racing?

 

[COGNITO]

here is the video of the 3 passes earlier in the race and the last one is yours George. Is this excessive?

 

[george.felix]

here is the video of the 3 passes earlier in the race and the last one is your George. Is this excessive?

No it wasn't. We honestly didn't know u were there as soon as u bumped us we moved right the fuck over. Nygren did also. You could have gone around but no it didn't look as hard as it was from our side. I'd add if it never was any worse than that then I'd be ok with it. At 60-70 mph no way. We were doing 45 maybe. I'd like to point out it took u longer to catch us than the others. Lol

For the record I never said that our nerf was excessive I said it was unnecessary which is debatable based on the video I'll admit.

 

[facteryfmf]

LoL! Excessive!!!

 

[facteryfmf]

No it wasn't. We honestly didn't know u were there as soon as u bumped us we moved right the fuck over. Nygren did also. You could have gone around but no it didn't look as hard as it was from our side.

I'll agree you moved over as soon as I bumped you! That's why nerfing is needed! I was never trying to take anyone out!!!

 

[COGNITO]

George, we cant see what is in front of you. If we would have moved over to go around you in the rough, we would have smacked that fence! We are lucky.... You on the other hand can see what is in front of you, that is why the car in front needs to move over for the car passing, it is just safer that way.

 

[JoeyD23]

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Kent Kroeker is not only a good friend. He is my hero and nerfing expert level 1000

 

[JoeyD23]

here is the video of the 3 passes earlier in the race and the last one is yours George. Is this excessive?

Text book

 

[BiggJim]

No it wasn't. We honestly didn't know u were there as soon as u bumped us we moved right the fuck over. Nygren did also. You could have gone around but no it didn't look as hard as it was from our side. I'd add if it never was any worse than that then I'd be ok with it. At 60-70 mph no way. We were doing 45 maybe. I'd like to point out it took u longer to catch us than the others. Lol

For the record I never said that our nerf was excessive I said it was unnecessary which is debatable based on the video I'll admit.

So why call casey and piss and moan that we nerfed you and took you out of the race?!?!

 

[COGNITO]

George and I talked we are all good

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[george.felix]

So why call casey and piss and moan that we nerfed you and took you out of the race?!?!

Well I didn't tell Casey I was taken out of the race nor did I say it was excessive. What I told him was some cars were hit hard and taken out....two to be exact. That's what we talked about mostly. He said he was going to talk to Justin and I said that's not my point Casey.

He asked me what I thought he should do and I said say something at the next drivers meeting that if you damage another car hitting them from behind it's your fault and pay the damage and whatever penalty the rules allow.

"Our 1958 car got hit hard by 1918 coming out of the pits at #3 denting our chromoly bumper." That's what I said and I thought your car had come right up on us and didn't realize we had 10 seconds. But most of the conversation w Casey was about cars hit and damaged not about our minor dents......was about the bigger picture as far as I was concerned. Tap tap is one thing slammed almost rolled shattered my transmission is another. That's what we talked about.

I'll call him again after seeing the video and set it straight as far as our car. I can't speak for the others.

 

[rupert14]

After watching that video the evidence is clear, go race AZOP. Plrase dont take offense to that but you have drawn a lot of attention to things that dont seem justified. Every time we call, complain, point fingers, etc it does not represent the UTV racing group well, and that includes all of us. That was nothing and you had plenty of time to see him and at least flash lights or hug the right so he knows you are trying to let him pass.

If that blew your transmission, check out the new Yamaha coming out.

 

[george.felix]

After watching that video the evidence is clear, go race AZOP. Plrase dont take offense to that but you have drawn a lot of attention to things that dont seem justified. Every time we call, complain, point fingers, etc it does not represent the UTV racing group well, and that includes all of us. That was nothing and you had plenty of time to see him and at least flash lights or hug the right so he knows you are trying to let him pass.

If that blew your transmission, check out the new Yamaha coming out.

I'm not sure what your referring I never said our car was damaged but two others were and others in other races have been knocked out of races. FYI we had 10 seconds not exactly an eternity. We should have looked at mirrors at the stop. I agree.

There are a lot of teams that don't believe in nerfing as a first resort for whatever reason it's not just me if you read all the comments including a Polaris factory team. I think you missed the point which was as I stated over done and too quick to pull the trigger jeopardizing everyone like what happened to 1916 car.

Rupert we started 21 at Baja 500 and broke in 4th. Started V2 R 17 and was 7th when things started to fall apart so I think we belong and getting better.

The other thing you completely ignore is the fact that it's against the rules that were in place long before me. . How do you justify that? I'm all ears to hear your thoughts about rules and what they mean. I mean if it's not against the rules then there's no reason or grounds to complain about it. Care to comment on that?

 

[george.felix]

Just to quantify the value of nerfing if you double the time we didn't move to 20 seconds and assume they're running an optimistic 8 mph avg faster than us that puts the nerfing car at over 50 mpg avg pace which is faster than anyone has run all season. The nerf gained them 200 ft. I don't know how long the 1916 car was "holding them up " but they were avg 44.7 mph. Do the same math and the nerf could have gained at most 1000 ft if it was prolonged. But the actual nerf cost 13,700 feet plus the time to repair damage another 27,900 ft. so 41,600 ft loss to gain 1,000 ft. Makes no sense if you believe in math.

Again that's all a moot point if you can't get past the fact the rules simply don't allow it. With all the talk about rules and rule changes etc it's a bit ironic this rule you want to ignore. It seems to me you should be trying to change the rule instead of trying to justify why breaking the rule is the correct thing to do and good for the sport. It sounds a lot like the rules you don't like don't matter or apply to you for your own personal reasons. Is that good for any sport and something you would teach your kids?

No one will address this directly and this will possibly end the thread because you can defend the indefensible. The only option to have it your way is to change the rules to from nerfing is NOT allowed to Nerfing IS allowed. When that happens it will become a matter of choice how to run your race if it's worth the risk etc. right now it can get you DQ 'd.

 

[COGNITO]

I'm not sure what your referring I never said our car was damaged but two others were and others in other races have been knocked out of races. FYI we had 10 seconds not exactly an eternity. We should have looked at mirrors at the stop. I agree.

There are a lot of teams that don't believe in nerfing as a first resort for whatever reason it's not just me if you read all the comments including a Polaris factory team. I think you missed the point which was as I stated over done and too quick to pull the trigger jeopardizing everyone like what happened to 1916 car.

Rupert we started 21 at Baja 500 and broke in 4th. Started V2 R 17 and was 7th when things started to fall apart so I think we belong and getting better.

The other thing you completely ignore is the fact that it's against the rules that were in place long before me. . How do you justify that? I'm all ears to hear your thoughts about rules and what they mean. I mean if it's not against the rules then there's no reason or grounds to complain about it. Care to comment on that?

Are you saying what we did to get around you, the nerf, is against the rules?

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[joncon]

I have been passed twice by Justin in a pure race. We were in a slower stock 4 seater running in a different class. Justin can verify just how dusty that race was. Co-dawg checked mirrors constantly and we got the f' out of the way for faster cars. We were always able to pull over within a few seconds of him catching us and guess what -he only had to use siren - no bump! It's slower cars responsibility to know someone is catching them and move over (assuming siren is on at least)

I don't think any of the top pro's will intentionally punt/ram someone as it's too dangerous to their personal chances of winning. I don't race BITD but just wanted to give my personal experience racing with Cognito.