Cost of Winning: The Monster Mav Chronicles

Slow it down here for a second. This seems to happen every time you get to explaining this rear diff thing. My disagreements in re locating the diff are strictly regarding the "so called" power gain of 12-15hp. You can try to prove it with mathematics but I can prove it with real world experience and what (in this case) has not proven the results claimed in any way shape or form.
We extended the wheelbase in our kit for high speed stability and to gain the 2 extra inches of wheel travel just like Can Am released this morning. MY Maverick in testing did not pickup any speed in a given distance nor did the clutching change at all after aligning the rear axles.
Please don't bring me into your posts, we never came around to your reasons of freed up HP because it isn't true.
 
Reed, We too are a factory Can Am team.. sometimes I think you drink too much of your green goo.. you were not the first Can Am to have a front steer... you were not the first team to have pushed back the diff to realign the rear CV's (we did this back in early 2012 on our BITD Commander along with pushed back rear suspension) or putting blowers on the CVT's. You're still relatively new to the BITD scene- I appreciate you openness and willingness to share what you do, but just because it isn't posted here at the UTVUG... doesn't mean it hasn't happen elsewhere.. whether it be the Murray's, Cory or ourselves.. we all have been modifying and pushing the the Can Ams to new levels for years. BTW, our conversations with BRP engineers are not just at the races... I know the previously mentioned teams and us have spent hundreds if not thousands of hours collectively working with the BRP engineers sharing our experience on how to improve the BRP products. [/quote]

I don't believe that I have ever expressed or implied that I was the "first" to innovate any of the mods performed on our Maverick, nor am I ignorant enough to think that they are not being done somewhere else, by somebody other than myself. If you saw the fundamental advantage to re locating the rear differential on your Commander prior to my building the Monster Mav , or implementing the front steer design that I saw on your Maverick at this years Mint 400, well kudos to you for doing the obvious.

The threads I start are definitely vanity based, but more so are there for all to learn by. If narcissism could be possessed by an inanimate object, the Monster Mav surely has it. These threads are not about me, they are about the development and evolution of our car. On occasions such as this one, I take pride in knowing that it was my designs that motivated/encouraged/prompted (choose an adverb) a large corporation to make a major change in the layout of the product they sell to the general public. It was only after I discussed in depth the kinematics of angular momentum with the Can-am "people" at this years Mint 400 did I hear of their plans to incorporate such a change in their upcoming line up. I don't see you, or many other teams posting to the masses detailed information on the changes they make to their race cars, and even offering help to other members or teams on how to perform them.

In my eyes, reverse engineering, and the application of past technologies is what so many race teams in motorsports base their designs upon. With the exception of F-1 and Moto GP racing, most everyone is just copying someone else's good ideas. Including me. I'm only trying to make the designs used on the Monster Mav , and how it has or has not worked for us,available for all to learn by. I do this because as a young fabricator (way before the internet was ever available) I searched long and hard for any information that could help me build a better car, and the only place I had any luck was in books on F-1 and road racing design and engineering. The crossover of useable technologies is still a gray area for me, but I always try to discipline my work with fundamental guidelines proven by those masters.

I'm not here to profit from my work, nor am I here to take credit for other peoples designs or ideas. I am merely sharing my knowledge and experiencewith the masses. Free of charge. So lighten up a bit , Mike. Join the ranks, and share what you are doing with your race car with the masses here in these forums, so we all can learn something from your experiences, be them hardships or successes. Just for the record, I do over indulge in the green goo, except it is more of a brownish colored liquid called STOUT!
 
Last edited:
Slow it down here for a second. This seems to happen every time you get to explaining this rear diff thing. My disagreements in re locating the diff are strictly regarding the "so called" power gain of 12-15hp. You can try to prove it with mathematics but I can prove it with real world experience and what (in this case) has not proven the results claimed in any way shape or form.
We extended the wheelbase in our kit for high speed stability and to gain the 2 extra inches of wheel travel just like Can Am released this morning. MY Maverick in testing did not pickup any speed in a given distance nor did the clutching change at all after aligning the rear axles.
Please don't bring me into your posts, we never came around to your reasons of freed up HP because it isn't true.

My estimates are mathematical ones. I clearly stated that I have yet to prove them on a dyno. While your motivation for component design and layouts are performance AND profit based (you are selling the kit to the public, identifying the kit as the first to offer the rear diff relocation, correct?), mine are for the sake of sharing ideas, opinions, facts and results with all who care to read about it. I'm not in competition with you or your company, and don't know why it seems that you sometimes attempt to discredit me. You say you have proven my claims (in the real world) to be false. Well, educate me then. If the only change you did to the car was move the diff back, then share the before and after dynamometer results. It has to be with the same tire size and weight, clutch set up, and cv joints/wheel bearing and u joint components to be an accurate number. I will be doing just that in the future, and will share the results here, whether they favor my predictions or not.

Are you seeing reduced temperatrures in the cv's? Are you getting more reliable miles out of them, or is it just 2" of wheel travel you went through all of that labor for? Let me be clear to the thought process behind relocating the rear diff. My number one reason for moving back the rear diff was tire clearance and weight bias. Then wheelbase and stability. Then wheel travel and cv joint longevity. The alleged gain in rear wheel h.p. is a bonus, and as of this posting, strictly theoretical. It will be proven true or false in the future with hard numbers from a dynamometer that I promise will be posted here for all to learn by.

Lighten up. I'm a member of a forum, not a competing manufacturer. I only boasted the fact that after publicly exposing our set up, others have followed suit. If you want to say that my claims of added rear wheel h.p. are false, then back your smack with facts.
 
9410dd55e6bc431fa137e4a44b070c61.jpg

Here's mine right now....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
9410dd55e6bc431fa137e4a44b070c61.jpg

Here's mine right now....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
So, was the number 8 1/2" for the diff? It sure looks like the current location is closer to 12 1/2". What are your plans for the toe links? In the current position, you will never get the toe links to work using the stock pivots. I'm guessing that the diff is not currently in its final mounting position. Kinda makes you wish for 25 grand so you can go turbo, huh? My hats off to you Jim. You certainly are grabbing the proverbial bull by the horns! Before welding the mounting tabs for the diff, put a rod through the splines, and plumb some lines on the ground to be sure that the diff is square with the chassis.
 
Reid might not have been the first to make some of these changes but I would put more weight on him influencing these changes in the new model. The reason is because he is vocal about what he has done to improve on their design and that rubs a corporation to till they do something.

See, they want their "factory teams" to be good little soldiers and never say anything to discredit them. At the same time they like the aftermarket guys to come up with bolt on upgrades because people always want to personalize and a lot of buying decisions are made on is aftermarket parts are available for a particular model.

Now you get someone like Reid bringing the obvious flaws out in a public manner and they need to do something to save their credibility. If it was a simple bolt on a muffler and gain 10hp or slap this shock on and you can pound to bumps then CanAm could care less. However moving a diff back is not something the average or even above average owner is going to do. They can't kick Reid to the curb because he is winning but they would much rather him talk about how perfect the car if from the factory and it only needed safety upgrades and a booger green paint job to go out and kick some trash.

Ruffling some feathers in a public way gets shit done. You can talk all you want to the engineers behind the scenes and they let it go in one ear and out the other. After all, they have the degree to show that they did it right in the first place. Reid, thanks for being a brazen SOB. I enjoy it. Thanks for all you share. You are helping to advance the sport both on a personal level and at the corporate office. I was hoping to meet you at V2R but never even saw the MAV at tech. Maybe next season if we get our car done and if you are still running a UTV.
 
Reid might not have been the first to make some of these changes but I would put more weight on him influencing these changes in the new model. The reason is because he is vocal about what he has done to improve on their design and that rubs a corporation to till they do something.

See, they want their "factory teams" to be good little soldiers and never say anything to discredit them. At the same time they like the aftermarket guys to come up with bolt on upgrades because people always want to personalize and a lot of buying decisions are made on is aftermarket parts are available for a particular model.

Now you get someone like Reid bringing the obvious flaws out in a public manner and they need to do something to save their credibility. If it was a simple bolt on a muffler and gain 10hp or slap this shock on and you can pound to bumps then CanAm could care less. However moving a diff back is not something the average or even above average owner is going to do. They can't kick Reid to the curb because he is winning but they would much rather him talk about how perfect the car if from the factory and it only needed safety upgrades and a booger green paint job to go out and kick some trash.

Ruffling some feathers in a public way gets shit done. You can talk all you want to the engineers behind the scenes and they let it go in one ear and out the other. After all, they have the degree to show that they did it right in the first place. Reid, thanks for being a brazen SOB. I enjoy it. Thanks for all you share. You are helping to advance the sport both on a personal level and at the corporate office. I was hoping to meet you at V2R but never even saw the MAV at tech. Maybe next season if we get our car done and if you are still running a UTV.
Zane, I really appreciate your support and kind words. My goal here has never been to bash any entity, myself not withstanding! I only seek to expose our car and it's flaws, or sparkles, be it a result of factory engineering, or my efforts here in the shop. I am a bit vocal about shortcomings that appear to me to be obvious, or "no-brainer" fixes. At our level, those lay-mans oversights are indicative of laziness, or lack of motivation and can only net less than desirable results.

Yeah, about tech, we rolled in 6 a.m. race day morning by the skin of our teeth as always, and drove straight to the starting line where Cory teched the car on the spot!
 
Is that your plan this week?
I'm assuming that's a rhetorical question, but I'll respond. It's never a plan to cram so many hours into the last couple of days leading up to an event. I wear all of the hats here (except for the "helmet"), and am a stickler for details as well. Our shop leaves a lot to be desired as far as being a real fab shop is concerned, so my hands are working overtime as a result. I think our results this year speak as to the preparedness in which Marc receives the car from me. Being obsessive compulsive, I unfortunately tend to practice redundancy more often than not.

As I write this, I just wrapped up the temporary race build for the Desert Challenge, and am testing tonight and tomorrow as well. We should be ahead of the curve this time around, but that assumes a productive test session, netting no major issues.
 
please post pics of the car
I'm so bummed out. As you all may have noticed, there has been an absence of images in this journal as of late. My camera grew legs at the V2R race so I'm without, and no, I do not own one of those "stupid smart" phones that take pictures with clarity nearly equal that of the Hubble telescope! Good news is, I'll be buying a new camera, AND a movie camera as well, so I can continue on the path of sharing our journey with you guys.

There needs to be more UTV videos on you tube or where ever, and I will see to it that fans of quality UTV racing vid's will have another source to feed their appetite for the sport. It would be nice to have a video record of our stellar season, but the financiers of UTV racing videos are a bit partial, and understandably so. You never know, we just might be watching the racing action from the sidelines next year!
 
Had the privilege of being invited to Professor Reid's off road laboratory last week. Wow - did I learn a LOT! The 'dirt lab' may not look like the show shops of other teams, but passion and knowledge are top notch. Thanks for all the "teaching" - it will be put to use. Looking forward to more lessons and photos.
Good luck at the SCORE DC this coming weekend.


www.NorthwestOffroad.net
 
Had the privilege of being invited to Professor Reid's off road laboratory last week. Wow - did I learn a LOT! The 'dirt lab' may not look like the show shops of other teams, but passion and knowledge are top notch. Thanks for all the "teaching" - it will be put to use. Looking forward to more lessons and photos.
Good luck at the SCORE DC this coming weekend.


www.NorthwestOffroad.net
Yeah, the Coyote brought me up some "Acme" beer, which I am enjoying the last bottle right vnow. Lucky me, no explosions!!
 

Members online

No members online now.

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
17,310
Messages
179,412
Members
12,152
Latest member
Hickoryjoe
Back
Top