Parker Draw Order
- Thread starter george.felix
- Start date
george.felix
George
I think that needs to be confirmed with BITD cuz the order in the pro production class at first glance doesn't appear to reflect that.
george.felix
George
CLARIFICATION: The Pro Production class were the guys who raced EVERY race which was only 5 they got the top spots then everyone else was in the random draw. Jagged is correct hereafter the top 10 from the previous race will start in that order and everyone else will be in the random draw.
george.felix
George
Yeah but it kills the multiple pages of opinions and speculation coupled with outrage and conspiracy theories. Fuck that could have taken us all the way into the next race. Oh well good chance something will happen at Parker to keep shit interesting. Maybe you could add some boost or something behind Walmart after Tech.
#xpwarrior
Active Member
Hmm. So from this point forward the top ten finishers do not go into a draw but everyone else does. Basically this is the "never get clean air rule". I see no point in entering a draw if the possibility of getting a clean air start in never going to happen. Its almost better to have a rear start and everyone has to worry about corrected time.
Maybe not having something to really complain about until the race is my worry because I need it to focus. Thanks for the clarification of this new draw/start order that I haven't found in the rules yet.
Maybe not having something to really complain about until the race is my worry because I need it to focus. Thanks for the clarification of this new draw/start order that I haven't found in the rules yet.
george.felix
George
I think everyone at Parker will have clean air......maybe wet but clean. Works for me cuz I don't hear very well in the dust.
BiggJim
I Hate Rules - UTVUnderground Approved
Why you gotta give up our behind walmart spot.
If you keep your car together and finish a race without any issues while driving at 85% you will Top Ten easy. Getting a top 10 happens before you ever load the car to go to the race event.
jdrew1965
Member
We will surprise you this year Johnny. I know that you like starting behind slow drivers sometimes because it gives you confidence knowing you are faster.
It'sYourLegacy
Banned Por Vida
How many short-end-of-the-stick draw entries 'trying' to make it into the top 10...are driving 84.9% not by 'choice'...but by factors (now) out of their control during any given race? Did the top ten teams last year "drive" at 85.1%...110%...or what was 'the average' for somebody earning that end-of-season placement?
(Joe Schmoe in 2016):
"..Hmmm..I play by the rules..I don't simply ram people out of my way (again, that silly rule/honor thing that I live by)..and I've got 'x' cars ALWAYS ahead of me to ALWAYS pace/siren...while still maintaining 85.0% to "Top Ten easy"..".
Pray tell why this isn't a slap in the face to every 'peon privateer' or any other talented team just getting started in 2016? Last year's top 10 benefited from the draw process...yet are allowed to use the same draw against every other team in the very first race? And this following a championship points season that was decided by what...how many cars entered the very last race?
(Agreed to by every race team but one with the sense or guts to question why or how this 'game changing' rule was introduced):
Not even the very first race of the season can possibly be contested on a level playing field.
Yet again, 'new rules' appear out of nowhere in this class (without commentary) as if everybody is dumb enough to believe that they will have absolutely no adverse affect whatsoever on future outcomes for years to come.
Even sadder is the fact that more than a few of these 'top 10' teams were publicly pushing for exactly this change last year (although never bold enough to lobby for their 2015 positions to be 'grandfathered')...and (apparently) nobody noticed.
The "smoke and mirrors" legacy of the 2015 1900 class lives on.
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It'sYourLegacy
Banned Por Vida
Here's what the stripping shop offered almost a year ago:
"...You should be rewarded for running the season start with parker make that race a draw race. Then from that race on make it start were you finished from that point on. If you want to come in after that race you move down to last guy that started all races and make it a drawing from that point on. To make it interesting you invert top 10 one race then maybe 10-20 keep switching it around make it interesting all season. But for mad media/utv underground make utvwc a qualify race to get into mint400..."
It's amazing to me just how 'perplexed' everybody becomes after this exact same topic was plopped right down in front of everybody in 2015 (see post #29 if you don't believe it)..and then 'amazingly' comes to be.
At least Johnny gave the rest of the class a heads up back then and told everybody exactly how he felt both then and now...even while many top 10 racers kept their opinions to themselves (in both instances) for obvious reasons.
Small wonder why this topic got so little (or no) commentary from season ending top ten teams after everybody figured out that the (faux) draw wasn't indeed 'chance' after all.
"...You should be rewarded for running the season start with parker make that race a draw race. Then from that race on make it start were you finished from that point on. If you want to come in after that race you move down to last guy that started all races and make it a drawing from that point on. To make it interesting you invert top 10 one race then maybe 10-20 keep switching it around make it interesting all season. But for mad media/utv underground make utvwc a qualify race to get into mint400..."
It's amazing to me just how 'perplexed' everybody becomes after this exact same topic was plopped right down in front of everybody in 2015 (see post #29 if you don't believe it)..and then 'amazingly' comes to be.
At least Johnny gave the rest of the class a heads up back then and told everybody exactly how he felt both then and now...even while many top 10 racers kept their opinions to themselves (in both instances) for obvious reasons.
Small wonder why this topic got so little (or no) commentary from season ending top ten teams after everybody figured out that the (faux) draw wasn't indeed 'chance' after all.
It'sYourLegacy
Banned Por Vida
Everybody out there (I hope) believes that they can race themselves back out of of anywhere in the draw and into a top ten guaranteed starting position. If not, this same promise should be signed in blood before anybody is allowed to even enter this type of race (safety first).
When you offer that:
"...to me its the finally get clean air rule and not be "draw" material behind people that dont ever expect to finish in the top ten and think its the never get clean air rule..."
...you're clumping one heck of a lot of racers together even if "I'm not even racing to be in the top 10" teams do indeed exist (let's hear some confessions if they do).
It appears that the entire Top 10 (from last year) are ALL evidently deep in necessary protracted denial of any obvious advantage gained over the rest of the class in grandfathering this first start.
While I certainly respect their unanimous opinion..I can see where a good number of fans would be rooting for 'anyone' selectively draw disadvantaged (especially in the first race of a season) to take home an even more well deserved championship in the end.
Sorry...yet I strongly feel that this upcoming championship has been tainted well before it even starts.
jdrew1965
Member
Is it possible for me to finish top ten...YES! At that point I would benefit from this new start order rule, cool. I don't think that makes it right, nor am I saying it isn't right because it has affected my starting position at this race. I am simply tired of the BITD allowing the UTV class to be the forgotten about step children they don't want to actually deal with. We (the UTV class) have more class entries than any other class. This class has brought primary race sponsorships to races and BITD yet it seems as though this class is not treated as a legitimate off road class like other classes are.
I may not have a title sponsor and maybe opening my mouth will hurt me in the end, but geeze! This series and class adds rules that aren't written in a rule book, introduces rules that do not consider difference in design, limit the ability of teams in this class to race up a class (which is allowed in other classes), gives us 4 races in 4 months (one being mandatory for us in points but a nationwide call out to anyone which hurts the privateer in our series) and has races like the Parker 250 but we only race 160 miles.
Another night before rule change: first letter for the Parker 250 stated tech began at noon, the final letter after pre registration and the draw stated tech started at 10 am. Now UTVRA posts on Instagram that tech begins at 8 am. Should I worry worry that presaging for the race isn't 11 and it gets changed tomorrow night after the drivers meeting to 6am.
I may not have a title sponsor and maybe opening my mouth will hurt me in the end, but geeze! This series and class adds rules that aren't written in a rule book, introduces rules that do not consider difference in design, limit the ability of teams in this class to race up a class (which is allowed in other classes), gives us 4 races in 4 months (one being mandatory for us in points but a nationwide call out to anyone which hurts the privateer in our series) and has races like the Parker 250 but we only race 160 miles.
Another night before rule change: first letter for the Parker 250 stated tech began at noon, the final letter after pre registration and the draw stated tech started at 10 am. Now UTVRA posts on Instagram that tech begins at 8 am. Should I worry worry that presaging for the race isn't 11 and it gets changed tomorrow night after the drivers meeting to 6am.
george.felix
George
Instagram? That's comical and appropriate way to start the season.
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It'sYourLegacy
Banned Por Vida
I would argue that the grandfathered Parker start has already affected your starting position for the next race and all others after it. Everybody in the draw right now has been purposely disadvantaged from achieving what you (and frankly only you in the eyes if those keeping their mouths shut now/deleting posts) work hard/risk your life/dream/believe is possible. This race and who starts where could well be the entire championship points race coming off a season where the winning margin was indescribably slim. Remember, this rule was made purposely and without fanfare as even more factory sponsored teams were being put in to play. At least one of them needed an edge that the others would not receive in 2016 and privateers are mere collateral damage in that points meddling power-driven process with BITD. They want 'average' racers to blow this off. I'm saying please don't as this crap will screw you guys for years to come with even more money obviously flowing in.
"..I am simply tired of the BITD allowing the UTV class to be the forgotten about step children they don't want to actually deal with. We (the UTV class) have more class entries than any other class. This class has brought primary race sponsorships to races and BITD yet it seems as though this class is not treated as a legitimate off road class like other classes are.
I may not have a title sponsor and maybe opening my mouth will hurt me in the end, but geeze! This series and class adds rules that aren't written in a rule book, introduces rules that do not consider difference in design, limit the ability of teams in this class to race up a class (which is allowed in other classes), gives us 4 races in 4 months (one being mandatory for us in points but a nationwide call out to anyone which hurts the privateer in our series) and has races like the Parker 250 but we only race 160 miles.
Another night before rule change: first letter for the Parker 250 stated tech began at noon, the final letter after pre registration and the draw stated tech started at 10 am. Now UTVRA posts on Instagram that tech begins at 8 am. Should I worry worry that presaging for the race isn't 11 and it gets changed tomorrow night after the drivers meeting to 6am..."[/QUOTE]
I feel for you guys making up the bulk of this field all year long as this thread illustrates how the manufacturers and their sponsored teams are manipulating outcomes with no shame whatsoever. They want this thread to die a quick death and will punish any sponsored team (whether in the top 10 or not) who acts like a man or simply says that they won't accept a championship title that will never be legitimate should this race start in the manner that has been dictated.
By allowing this to happen, every single one of these teams will cement their reputation as being nothing but stooges for whoever throws support their way coveting a trophy that will become absolutely meaningless.
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It'sYourLegacy
Banned Por Vida
(correction):
You have '20' (not 10) teams keeping their mouths shut over this and towing the manufacturer's line (or more accurately simply looking out only for themselves) at the present time.
When you have that many teams more than willing to look the other way (especially when a class is intentionally 'split') to gain a HUGE advantage over their competitors...what does it say about the class itself (as a whole) when that green flag drops at Parker?
george.felix
George
The start order was predicated on who started every race in 2015 or put another way who spent the most money in entry fees. I'm not sure I agree with this being a HUGE advantage but it is an advantage.
bluediamond
Active Member
Not sure how many of you guys were around when we were racing 3 Wheelers back in the day. This stuff so reminds me of trying to compete against the factory Kawi and honda teams at all the national races back in the day. Towards the end we the well funded privateers had no shot with all the new rules or lack there of when it came to new technology coming out monthly and staging rules we had to deal with back then. Towards the end it was all factory all the time. This class seems to be going the same way unfortunately. Those we still were some of the best memories though.
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