New Honda Talon to launch Nov 27th 2018!

[It'sYourLegacy]

So you do not know how to operate an air compression and air nozzle? You act like it is some difficult task. You blow out the clutches to remove what dust is in there and gives you a chance to give to look at your belt. This is about as basic of a task as you can get. Guess what the clutches do come out nice a clean. I am not saying you need to do this after every ride when you are out on a multiple day trip. You do it when you get home before you wash your car.

I was really hoping that we wouldn't have to get in to the basic practical aspects of 'compressed air cleaning' by offering you a stick-a-nozzle-in-the-door-of-your-house example yet I obviously failed to consider the audience.
Blowing stuff around, while it may be the only method available, is not cleaning anything. This especially becomes obvious when one cannot even see what they are cleaning, let alone effectively reach (at the proper angle) what needs to be (cough) 'cleaned'. Add in the abrasive particles trapped in one position or another when the drive stopped and you have but one thing:
A half arse job done which many times exacerbates problems by blowing abrasive particles in to places that they would have never reached in the first place without your 'help'.

I think that we are simply entering an age where people will believe everything and that if there is a video made about it...it must be the way to go. I say this as it is very hard for me to believe that "cleaning your house with an air hose" does not hit home somehow yet perhaps I need to find a video...

...run it !!!

 

[sand shark]

I was really hoping that we wouldn't have to get in to the basic practical aspects of 'compressed air cleaning' by offering you a stick-a-nozzle-in-the-door-of-your-house example yet I obviously failed to consider the audience.
Blowing stuff around, while it may be the only method available, is not cleaning anything. This especially becomes obvious when one cannot even see what they are cleaning, let alone effectively reach (at the proper angle) what needs to be (cough) 'cleaned'. Add in the abrasive particles trapped in one position or another when the drive stopped and you have but one thing:
A half arse job done which many times exacerbates problems by blowing abrasive particles in to places that they would have never reached in the first place without your 'help'.

I think that we are simply entering an age where people will believe everything and that if there is a video made about it...it must be the way to go. I say this as it is very hard for me to believe that "cleaning your house with an air hose" does not hit home somehow yet perhaps I need to find a video...

...run it !!!

By your responses I can assume you have never cleaned your clutches on whatever SXS you may own. Your responses are very typical of an engineer that does not take actual real world experiences into account. If the computer says it will work or this will happen, then it must be true. Overthink simple tasks much?


I can assure you the clutches are clean and debris is not being moved from one spot to the next. I will go with what I know works for me. You can just cringe and shake your head at me and the vast majority of SXS owners that use the same method.

P.S. - I would use a leaf blower to clean my house, not an air compressor, it seems more efficient at moving stuff around. Plus I can't hear my wife screaming to stop using the leaf blower in the house. LOL!

 

[It'sYourLegacy]

(Honda Talon showroom in 2019):
Videos of those trying to sell you extra NEEDED or 'improved' non-OEM CVT parts...
Videos of those frustrated with springs, hammering and the very loud noises created but necessary for the job(s)...
An outdoor display where the wife can blow out her own CVT drive or watch her husband do it dressed up like a chemical emergency first responder.

Add in a video of an angry wife riding home from a ruined weekend due to their belt not necessarily failing as expected while taking other critical components out with it instead?

(Result):
Salesman doesn't even have to explain the "much more fun to drive" scenarios involving the only automatic/manual gear banging/fun loving transmission in existence.

Gosh, i wouldn't want my wife to read this thread or get caught chasing HP numbers instead....

 

[It'sYourLegacy]

[QUOTE="sand shark, post: 207919, member: 571"
P.S. - I would use a leaf blower to clean my house, not an air compressor, it seems more efficient at moving stuff around. Plus I can't hear my wife screaming to stop using the leaf blower in the house. LOL!

600 (pressure) + 700(Volume) = 800 (both)

LOL! Much agreed and I should have used that example as a leaf blower is my favorite tool.
We have the Stihl BR600, 700 and will probably get divorced over the 800 out this spring....with reachable pull cord (by gosh).

 

[sand shark]

(Honda Talon showroom in 2019):
Videos of those trying to sell you extra NEEDED or 'improved' non-OEM CVT parts...
Videos of those frustrated with springs, hammering and the very loud noises created but necessary for the job(s)...
An outdoor display where the wife can blow out her own CVT drive or watch her husband do it dressed up like a chemical emergency first responder.

Add in a video of an angry wife riding home from a ruined weekend due to their belt not necessarily failing as expected while taking other critical components out with it instead?

(Result):
Salesman doesn't even have to explain the "much more fun to drive" scenarios involving the only automatic/manual gear banging/fun loving transmission in existence.

Gosh, i wouldn't want my wife to read this thread or get caught chasing HP numbers instead....

(Honda Talon showroom in 2019):
Videos of those trying to sell you extra NEEDED or 'improved' non-OEM CVT parts...
Videos of those frustrated with springs, hammering and the very loud noises created but necessary for the job(s)...
An outdoor display where the wife can blow out her own CVT drive or watch her husband do it dressed up like a chemical emergency first responder.

Add in a video of an angry wife riding home from a ruined weekend due to their belt not necessarily failing as expected while taking other critical components out with it instead?

(Result):
Salesman doesn't even have to explain the "much more fun to drive" scenarios involving the only automatic/manual gear banging/fun loving transmission in existence.

Gosh, i wouldn't want my wife to read this thread or get caught chasing HP numbers instead....

Yamaha promo video had belts hanging in a tree (clever marketing).

Honda has a built in faithful market. They don't need to show videos of people changing belts or fixing things.

 

[It'sYourLegacy]

...by the way, I just noticed the "game changer' tag...not on purpose mind you...only chose that one for the German Stihl employee's first hand spiel...

 

[It'sYourLegacy]

If the Talon sells well without educating the public while the other shoe(s) drop at the same time then history will simply take over in terms of what is and always has been needed in a truly quality (fairly affordable) offroad car.

 

[It'sYourLegacy]

"....a small power NA car with set gears isnt gonna ever be as fast and give the fun factor for the guys looking for a thrill ride....double the HP and better suspension and bigger tires, you cant and won't ever overcome those hurdles. half the power, half the suspension, and 4" smaller tire. you can put the best racer you have ever met in the seat and he won't be able to keep up with a slightly modded stock X3 or TurboRZR..above you said something about how i "try to fix" the clutches, i dont try, i do fix them. i am the best on the market at building them better.

Since nobody else is apparently willing to contradict 'the best'; I will offer the following:

Neither of the machines listed is even close to "double the HP" of the Talon (208 HP) nor does the Talon possess "half the power".
"Half the suspension" is just as laughable.
"Small power" is not 104 HP (period) nor do "set gears" have anything to do with a "fun factor" besides creating driving experiences that rubber band driven machines cannot.

 

[sand shark]

Since nobody else is apparently willing to contradict 'the best'; I will offer the following:

Neither of the machines listed is even close to "double the HP" of the Talon (208 HP) nor does the Talon possess "half the power".
"Half the suspension" is just as laughable.
"Small power" is not 104 HP (period) nor do "set gears" have anything to do with a "fun factor" besides creating driving experiences that rubber band driven machines cannot.

No they do not have twice the hp, but a turbo with 60+ more hp is a big difference. You are probably not a dune person or someone that likes to rip across the desert, so HP is not your thing.

Nobody is arguing the Talon does not have good suspension numbers, nor does it have half the suspension. I rather have quality suspension that works properly. The Talon did skimp on the shocks with going to the QS3 on the 1000R model. I would of hoped they went the the Fox RC2 type shock on the 1000R.

A 104hp is small compared to what is out there in the Turbo market. In the non-turbo market there will not be a huge difference between the Talon, Yamaha or XP1000 as they are relatively close. They have speed limiters so it is just a race to bang off the speed limiter.

You seem to have ignored the issues the Pioneer was having and might still be having with the DCT transmission. The Pioneer is less hp and people were burning up the clutch packs.

 

[It'sYourLegacy]

No they do not have twice the hp, but a turbo with 60+ more hp is a big difference. You are probably not a dune person or someone that likes to rip across the desert, so HP is not your thing.

Again, we're back to the "go big or go home" (yet still put up with old rubber band technology ) / 30K+ fantasy world which the Talon obviously isn't competing in and which the average enthusiast cannot afford. Duners and desert folk have been having a blast with the exact same HP class of car that Honda has just produced. Please don't insult their intelligence nor working class structure by claiming that if they 'rolled' at one level or another they might just someday be a duner, a desert rat or "like" ripping through either.

"..Nobody is arguing the Talon does not have good suspension numbers, nor does it have half the suspension..

I'm not going to argue what has already been proven using quotes.

I rather have quality suspension that works properly. The Talon did skimp on the shocks with going to the QS3 on the 1000R model. I would of hoped they went the the Fox RC2 type shock on the 1000R.

Using "skimp" and "rather have quality suspension that works properly" along with a fantasy wish involving 30K+ car shocks is no different than expecting a larger motor. Perhaps they put that money in to a geared transmission that nobody is 'somehow' replicating and which is more fun to drive? I must be the only one in America who replaced my 'less than top of the line' WEs for obvious reasons.
[/QUOTE]

"...104hp is small compared to what is out there in the Turbo market. In the non-turbo market there will not be a huge difference between the Talon, Yamaha or XP1000 as they are relatively close. They have speed limiters so it is just a race to bang off the speed limiter. ..."

See first post above. Since the Wildcat XX at 130 HP NA is not mentioned with the same speed limiter we'll throw that one in too as 'close'. Meanwhile, we'll ask every 100 HP owner out there without another car in their future anytime soon if 104 HP ('or so') isn't making the family VERY happy already or somehow effectively keeping 'the shame' away.

You seem to have ignored the issues the Pioneer was having and might still be having with the DCT transmission. The Pioneer is less hp and people were burning up the clutch packs.

I already addressed those abusing DCT transmissions while stuck in a previous post along with the grounding issue that many manufacturers have had along with "..32 inch or go home!.." tire fantasies.
When an owner demands that a machine do more than it designed to do in an obvious manner...something is going to give.
Those comparing 30K+ cars to the Talon simply don't want to hear it.

 

[sand shark]

Again, we're back to the "go big or go home" (yet still put up with old rubber band technology ) / 30K+ fantasy world which the Talon obviously isn't competing in and which the average enthusiast cannot afford. Duners and desert folk have been having a blast with the exact same HP class of car that Honda has just produced. Please don't insult their intelligence nor working class structure by claiming that if they 'rolled' at one level or another they might just someday be a duner, a desert rat or "like" ripping through either.



I'm not going to argue what has already been proven using quotes.



Using "skimp" and "rather have quality suspension that works properly" along with a fantasy wish involving 30K+ car shocks is no different than expecting a larger motor. Perhaps they put that money in to a geared transmission that nobody is 'somehow' replicating and which is more fun to drive? I must be the only one in America who replaced my 'less than top of the line' WEs for obvious reasons.

See first post above. Since the Wildcat XX at 130 HP NA is not mentioned with the same speed limiter we'll throw that one in too as 'close'. Meanwhile, we'll ask every 100 HP owner out there without another car in their future anytime soon if 104 HP ('or so') isn't making the family VERY happy already or somehow effectively keeping 'the shame' away.



I already addressed those abusing DCT transmissions while stuck in a previous post along with the grounding issue that many manufacturers have had along with "..32 inch or go home!.." tire fantasies.
When an owner demands that a machine do more than it designed to do in an obvious manner...something is going to give.
Those comparing 30K+ cars to the Talon simply don't want to hear it.[/QUOTE]

So the DCT failed because of abuse, not because the engineers did not build it strong enough or design it to handle what the public does with the Pioneer.

So when the ball joints fail is that abuse too? Seems you chalk up Honda parts failing to abuse, but the other manufactures you find under built even thought the they are subjected to the same abuse.

Like I have already said - 104hp is not enough for where I like to ride. Fortunately there are a few manufacturers that offer me something.

If I was just a trail rider the Talon would be plenty.


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[Glamisfan]

Noel, just block itsyourlegacy like I did and you won’t have to keep arguing over and over and over!!!


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[sand shark]

Noel, just block itsyourlegacy like I did and you won’t have to keep arguing over and over and over!!!


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It’s like trying to reason with child. It gives me practice with my kid. Lol!

Hope to see you out in Glamis.


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[It'sYourLegacy]

Merry Christmas! (Billy Graham; February, 1918 - November 2018)

 

[JoeyD23]

The Talon would have been bad ass if they released it when the XP900 was king... Its dated for a "new" model year machine. Nice machine, not that easy on the eyes, likely be very well built and reliable, and fun for anyone who owns one. But I wouldn't take one over a Turbo S.

 

[sand shark]

The Talon would have been bad ass if they released it when the XP900 was king... Its dated for a "new" model year machine. Nice machine, not that easy on the eyes, likely be very well built and reliable, and fun for anyone who owns one. But I wouldn't take one over a Turbo S.

Your going to be accused of being fixated on HP. LOL!

 

[///Airdam Clutches]

i can see "ItsYourLegacy" trying to figure out how to use the #150psi air hose

https://media.giphy.com/media/FZomeTV3Xls4M/giphy.gif

 

[///Airdam Clutches]

Since nobody else is apparently willing to contradict 'the best'; I will offer the following:

Neither of the machines listed is even close to "double the HP" of the Talon (208 HP) nor does the Talon possess "half the power".
"Half the suspension" is just as laughable.
"Small power" is not 104 HP (period) nor do "set gears" have anything to do with a "fun factor" besides creating driving experiences that rubber band driven machines cannot.

90% of the power hungry guys have a reflash on their turbo car before the 6month warranty runs out. and a mild tune on either the X3 or TurboRZR is well into the range of double what the honda puts out. thats why i said the "power hungry" crowd. there are guys daily buying the stage 3, 4, and 5 setups for the 2018-2019 cars which will put out 190-225 crank hp. this is an every day dude sending off his computer, and running high octane pump gas. this isnt rocket science, you arent replacing head gaskets and bigger studs, or bolting on a 3000 turbo upgrade, this is no joke a simple reflash and 160whp is on the way. (195-200 crank hp)

honda might be there one day, but they just released a car to compete with the polaris RZR 900 from 2011. they have some catchin up to do.

 

[It'sYourLegacy]

Honda never intended for a 20K ( + or - ) Talon to 'compete' with a 30K ( + or - ) Turbo S.
With the government's current and perhaps permanent engine displacement size boot on UTV manufacturer's throats, the worldwide economy less than certain and disposable income in a luxury market at risk for countless other reasons…why would they? A UTV will not turn a measured culture on its head. Take a look at the entire Honda vehicle lineup and tell me where they are looking to capture every segment of a market at any price point….ever.
https://automobiles.honda.com

Honda isn’t feared here for what will happen this spring. It is the fact that most current owners are running less than quality overall systems spinning rubber bands driven by often overworked engines with Honda now in the game. Should Honda decide to shift gears again? A lot of people are going to be disappointed in their choices of not only machines but employers and aftermarket investments. These are not get-a-new-machine-'whenever' decisions for working families (period).

We’re headed for a shakeup in the UTV market and those still standing in the aftermath might just not be all of the usual suspects.

 

[BiggJim]

Honda never intended for a 20K ( + or - ) Talon to 'compete' with a 30K ( + or - ) Turbo S.
With the government's current and perhaps permanent engine displacement size boot on UTV manufacturer's throats, the worldwide economy less than certain and disposable income in a luxury market at risk for countless other reasons…why would they? A UTV will not turn a measured culture on its head. Take a look at the entire Honda vehicle lineup and tell me where they are looking to capture every segment of a market at any price point….ever.
https://automobiles.honda.com

Honda isn’t feared here for what will happen this spring. It is the fact that most current owners are running less than quality overall systems spinning rubber bands driven by often overworked engines with Honda now in the game. Should Honda decide to shift gears again? A lot of people are going to be disappointed in their choices of not only machines but employers and aftermarket investments. These are not get-a-new-machine-'whenever' decisions for working families (period).

We’re headed for a shakeup in the UTV market and those still standing in the aftermath might just not be all of the usual suspects.

Id take a tried and trued $14000 XP1K over a 20K honda talon. Even better yet Id run the single seat RS1 over the talon. Both of those machines in my opinion are leaps and bounds in front of the honda and they have a huge aftermarket already. Give it 3 years and I might change my mind if honda really steps up.