Arctic Cat and Mint 400

[kornfed]

Thats awesome. I have always been a Yamaha fan and grew up racing and riding their dirt bikes and quads. When they introduced the YXZ I was very disappointed with the design although it is ok for short course. I would love to see a build thread if possible.

Totally. The donor car was a mess. We did a quick goofball review pitting it against the Rustfish and a stock X3 on our Facebook page. It was so bad. I almost dumped in the first 3 miles. We called it a pogo stick. But that powertrain was nice. The new car takes some of the best from each and then goes off own its own where the manufactures miss the mark. The front suspension is killer. Full C1 type. With the dual shocks going to the bottom arms. Sneak peek again. ;-)

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[Ratoutahell]

wow! I'm excited about this!

 

[sand shark]

That is badass! Can't wait to see the final car


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[tatum]

Totally. The donor car was a mess. We did a quick goofball review pitting it against the Rustfish and a stock X3 on our Facebook page. It was so bad. I almost dumped in the first 3 miles. We called it a pogo stick. But that powertrain was nice. The new car takes some of the best from each and then goes off own its own where the manufactures miss the mark. The front suspension is killer. Full C1 type. With the dual shocks going to the bottom arms. Sneak peek again. ;-)

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Will the steering rack be in front?

 

[badassmav]

Hey kornfed, I was wondering if you were going to run stock-sized cv joints and hubs, as it appears that is what is currently fitted at the end of the rear trailing arms. I assume you are running a center steer rack mounted in front of the front axles. Is there a target GVW weight you guys are hoping to make? Like the other member commented , I too have been a long time fan of what the Pehnalls race. Their cars are always clean and capable. I have reservations though about the application of stock differential housings, and their ability to perform in an "unlimited" environment. Also, it is kind of hard to knock the performance of a CVT system that is dialed in. I'm not sure manual shifting can climb gears as fast as the cvt's do. Looks like a few teething pains lie ahead, but when aren't there? Hope you run it at the world championships. I'm glad to see someone going all in with a custom build (or, all out as one might say). The class deserves more than what most bolt on accessories offer.

 

[kornfed]

You are spot on about the steering and good eye on the CVs, but those are just mock ups. We have a custom set up that is pretty slick. Car should be under 2000, but there is a lot of steel here. The diff housing has some up members that actually support it. Also an alternator on the driveshaft like the Rustfish.

Like anything this will have some issues to work out, but when it works, it should fly. Also we are waiting on doing he motor work until after we get the car sorted. We will then bump it up. Step by step...


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[jakecarver91]

I understand when guys say the car belongs in the unlimited class but put the Speedcat next to the newest RMR build for Miller and tell me which car looks more like a UTV.

That's not the point. Looks has little to do with it as long as it's running the hood of a production car and some form of rear fender from the car.

The point is, anyone can go down to the dealer and buy an rzr xp4 turbo TODAY and chop it up to build a race car just like RMR did. The suspension pivot points, the drivetrain, etc is all a known. There are a lot of $40,000 or $50,000 race utvs out there that are still competitive with the $100,000+ rmr or jimco builds. Allowing a purpose built chassis/race car into a class with limited suspension/drivetrain is nonsense.

Keeping real "production" cars in the class is extremely important for the future of our sport. Take the production out and take the money out.... and by money I mean the Polaris mint 400 endorsement or the can am KOH endorsement, not the racer's paycheck. These endorsements are huge for all of desert racing.


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[thunder45]

Delete...post in wrong thread.

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[BiggJim]

You are spot on about the steering and good eye on the CVs, but those are just mock ups. We have a custom set up that is pretty slick. Car should be under 2000, but there is a lot of steel here. The diff housing has some up members that actually support it. Also an alternator on the driveshaft like the Rustfish.

Like anything this will have some issues to work out, but when it works, it should fly. Also we are waiting on doing he motor work until after we get the car sorted. We will then bump it up. Step by step...


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I think under 2000#'s (race ready) is extremely optimistic with 8 shocks. I only point out race ready becuase i see lots of folks talking about weight and 9 out of 10 times its dry, no spare, no tools, no ???

 

[kornfed]

I think under 2000#'s (race ready) is extremely optimistic with 8 shocks. I only point out race ready becuase i see lots of folks talking about weight and 9 out of 10 times its dry, no spare, no tools, no ???

No it will be much heavier at the line. The Rustfish is around 2000 dry and race ready is close to 2500. 32 gallons of fuel, tools, spares and the like. 2000 is the dry weight goal. With me and my co-driver we are close to 3k. You don't get the nickname Kornfed for nothin'. ;-)


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[BiggJim]

No it will be much heavier at the line. The Rustfish is around 2000 dry and race ready is close to 2500. 32 gallons of fuel, tools, spares and the like. 2000 is the dry weight goal. With me and my co-driver we are close to 3k. You don't get the nickname Kornfed for nothin'. ;-)


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LOL!! I know all about it brother...I have a shirt at home that reads I eat cornbread!

 

[kornfed]

LOL!! I know all about it brother...I have a shirt at home that reads I eat cornbread!

LOL... Where did you get that shirt...? ;-)


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[BiggJim]

LOL... Where did you get that shirt...? ;-)


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I dont know...it was a gift.

 

[kornfed]

That's not the point. Looks has little to do with it as long as it's running the hood of a production car and some form of rear fender from the car.

The point is, anyone can go down to the dealer and buy an rzr xp4 turbo TODAY and chop it up to build a race car just like RMR did. The suspension pivot points, the drivetrain, etc is all a known. There are a lot of $40,000 or $50,000 race utvs out there that are still competitive with the $100,000+ rmr or jimco builds. Allowing a purpose built chassis/race car into a class with limited suspension/drivetrain is nonsense.

Keeping real "production" cars in the class is extremely important for the future of our sport. Take the production out and take the money out.... and by money I mean the Polaris mint 400 endorsement or the can am KOH endorsement, not the racer's paycheck. These endorsements are huge for all of desert racing.


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I agree totally. There should be true production modified cars that race in the Production Classes and these one offs should be in Unlimited. Even if AC says the RG car is a production car, it is not. It would be like us calling Yamaha and saying, sell a Yamaha Penhall T9AX whatever and we can now run our new car in Production class. It is not a production car. It is a full blown race car with a 1 liter motor. That is not what a production class should be. Also I think it would be great if others teams built unlimited cars. An unlimited class for 1 liter would be pretty damn cool. They are kind of a weird place right now. I think eventually people will like the 1 liter unlimited cars. It is pretty cool.

 

[badassmav]

I think under 2000#'s (race ready) is extremely optimistic with 8 shocks. I only point out race ready becuase i see lots of folks talking about weight and 9 out of 10 times its dry, no spare, no tools, no ???

Optimistic to say the least! I'll go out on a limb here (or rather a sturdy metal pole) and add that anyone claiming a wet weight of under 2,000 lbs. at the dropping of the green flag is either lying to you, or not prepared to win that race. With that being said, I don't feel that a well built unlimited UTE that comes in just under 3k wet (including occupants) couldn't be competitive. It looks like kornfed may be one of the first entries in the unlimited class (Speedcats excluded) that truly lives up to the classification. I'm on your side Jim about the extra shock. I think its value is questionable given the weight penalty attached to it. Thanks for sharing details kornfed. It all comes out in the end anyway. Secret-smeakrit!

 

[Bricoop]

I agree totally. There should be true production modified cars that race in the Production Classes and these one offs should be in Unlimited. Even if AC says the RG car is a production car, it is not. It would be like us calling Yamaha and saying, sell a Yamaha Penhall T9AX whatever and we can now run our new car in Production class. It is not a production car. It is a full blown race car with a 1 liter motor. That is not what a production class should be. Also I think it would be great if others teams built unlimited cars. An unlimited class for 1 liter would be pretty damn cool. They are kind of a weird place right now. I think eventually people will like the 1 liter unlimited cars. It is pretty cool.

Your car sounds rad, I'm looking forward to seeing it hit the track.


Using that same line of thinking, saying what runs in the production class now is a production car is a bit disingenuous...How is paying Arctic Cat for a production class racing UTV different than paying Jimco to create a production class racing UTV from a stock model?

 

[kornfed]

Optimistic to say the least! I'll go out on a limb here (or rather a sturdy metal pole) and add that anyone claiming a wet weight of under 2,000 lbs. at the dropping of the green flag is either lying to you, or not prepared to win that race. With that being said, I don't feel that a well built unlimited UTE that comes in just under 3k wet (including occupants) couldn't be competitive. It looks like kornfed may be one of the first entries in the unlimited class (Speedcats excluded) that truly lives up to the classification. I'm on your side Jim about the extra shock. I think its value is questionable given the weight penalty attached to it. Thanks for sharing details kornfed. It all comes out in the end anyway. Secret-smeakrit!

Never said wet weight under 2000. Just pointing that out. I know weights and we got a lot of it. Dry weight goal is 2000. At the line will be close to 3000. Since Kent and Craig will be doing the driving, it will be less than Jason and I, but still close.

Thanks for the nod, on the true unlimited. That is the idea. Let's see what a 1 liter car can really do. Gotta get that car done or won't debut until Vegas to Reno. YIKES... Pressure is on.

 

[kornfed]

Your car sounds rad, I'm looking forward to seeing it hit the track.


Using that same line of thinking, saying what runs in the production class now is a production car is a bit disingenuous...How is paying Arctic Cat for a production class racing UTV different than paying Jimco to create a production class racing UTV from a stock model?

I think the difference between the Jimco, RMR and our Penhall Production Car is that we are all based upon a stock platform that is sold to the masses. The line is a bit blurry here, but they are pretty close to the production cars in design. Not in parts, but design. We use the stock pick up locations, stock sections of the frame and keep the general configuration of the original car. The RG cars are much different than the baseline car, from what I have seen. There are a lot of people here that know a lot more than I do, but to me the RG car is a new car, not a modified AC. If they sell a 1000 of those, then they are production. Otherwise, I think it is an unlimited car. My opinion.

 

[Bricoop]

Based on what @///Airdam Clutches posted earlier in this thread, there is no difference between the stock pick up locations, stock sections of the frame and configuration of the original car. The chassis goes back to AC for the VIN.

 

[tatum]

That's not the point. Looks has little to do with it as long as it's running the hood of a production car and some form of rear fender from the car.

The point is, anyone can go down to the dealer and buy an rzr xp4 turbo TODAY and chop it up to build a race car just like RMR did. The suspension pivot points, the drivetrain, etc is all a known. There are a lot of $40,000 or $50,000 race utvs out there that are still competitive with the $100,000+ rmr or jimco builds. Allowing a purpose built chassis/race car into a class with limited suspension/drivetrain is nonsense.

Keeping real "production" cars in the class is extremely important for the future of our sport. Take the production out and take the money out.... and by money I mean the Polaris mint 400 endorsement or the can am KOH endorsement, not the racer's paycheck. These endorsements are huge for all of desert racing.


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Right now I agree that the RGM cars should be in the unlimited class because the production units aren't on the dealer floors yet. These cars are running the production car pick up points, steering, and drive train and should be legal once they hit the showrooms imo.

The way the class is evolving the 40/50k cars are not going to keep the speeds necessary if you ask me. I'm not sure if Polaris wants you guys to retain all your stock suspension geometry but I think more people are going to need to start taking advantage of the rules to relieve some of the stress you guys are putting on suspension components. Unless the Mint was a fluke it seems to be proving the point. I realize its very cost effective to bolt on some sponsors parts, but when you are widening these cars you are creating some serious loads that could be substantially reduced just by changing the shock geometry.

At the end of the day though you still need a lot more than just the best car on the race course.