IS AVE/BP RACING stepping on its "JOHNSON"?

[lucho]

BOLD STEP FOR AVE/BP RACING

BUT “IT MUST BE DONE”


California City, CA – Ave/Baja Promotions took the first step (some may call it a bold one, while others may say foolish) in announcing that the entire 2016 PURE UTV OFF-ROAD DESERT SERIES will be a totally GPS-based series, meaning that all courses will be marked by GPS only, with little or no actual visual course markings on the course. This is something that race promoter, Lou Peralta has been touting for years, trying to encourage the “big boys” to do likewise, but to no avail, until 2016, that is.


Peralta was contacted to explain further; “I believe that time has come for every promoter to start thinking that way, and certainly for us. Last year we were saddled with what I would call (to be gentile about it), “stinkers” who seemed to come out Friday nights and disturb our courses. These creeps could be anyone, but we have our own suspicions of locals who may drink a bit too much and then try to create mayhem. Environmental Zealots, I call them. We can’t go on and continue to put on great and safe events without trying to mitigate the situation.” Peralta concluded.


To be entirely correct, Peralta has been using GPS and giving the courses to the racers for years. AVE/Baja Promotions has reported that perhaps as many as 95% of the racers in the series already use the GPS file that AVE/Baja Promotions provides. Those who fit into AVE/Baja Promotions’ classes of “Bone Stock 1000” and “Bone Stock 900” – both Sportsman classes with mostly entry level racers, will have to learn to use GPS quickly.


According to Race Director, Alan Bell, “We will lay out the course weeks in advance and make sure to go through it several times, and then release the actual race course to those who have signed up, at least one weekend before the event. Thusly, we are prepared to give racers more than just a day to pre-run, which, in the past has been restricted to only on the Friday before the race. To be sure we have to improve our GPS plotting to make sure everyone can read the course. Moreover, we now know that the second most important person in the team will be the “Navigator” because it will be up to the “Navigator” to help the racers stay on course.”

Peralta also added, “I believe now that the task of the “Navigator” is as important as that of the “Driver” in the team, both Racers and Navigators will earn points towards class and overall points championships.”


Racers will now have a whole week to pre-run but only if they are signed up for the event. We’ve also learned that AVE/BP Racing will, nonetheless, have some course marking along the way to reassure racers that they are on the course. What type of markers, has not yet been announced, but according to Peralta, “They will be unmistakable and easy to find and unique to us.”


A new era, at least for AVE/Baja Promotions, begins in 2016, on how their courses will be laid out. Peralta was asked what effect he thinks this new move will have on his entries? He stated, “I will have either stepped on my ‘Johnson’ big-time or might have made the right decision, at least for our races here. I believe it will help tremendously our series because it will avoid the shenanigans we have been encountering here in the past six to eight months. We have to do something. I’ve also been suggesting this to other promoters to do likewise because I can see where they could solve a lot of their problems, especially when dealing with heavy spectator traffic. I know BITD and SNORE and MORE and others have one set of problems while SCORE has others. This GPS racing, I think will help.”


The 2016 AVE/Baja Promotions Series begins January 23, with the running of the PURE #1 – “150” in Cal City. Other dates are March 19, April 23, July 16 (a night race), September 10 and the PURE #6 “200” – October 22, all in California City, at the AVE Ranch, 138th & Proctor.

The best five (5) out of the six finishes will be computed for year-end championships in the Overall points and by Class p[oints championships. One requirement; a racer must compete in at least three (3) events to qualify for championship titles.


Two other UTV races are also on AVE/BP schedule but do not count for the Series points. Instead, they count for the ENSENADA CUP. These two events will run in Punta Banda, Baja California, Mexico, inside Ejido Coronel Esteban Cantu. The dates are; May 28 and October 1. Course marking and GPS will be used for that event, which runs in combination with the Motorcycle and ATV Gran Prix events also on the same date, but at different times


For more details please visit www.averacing.com or contact info@averacing.com -

 

[ironworks]

To be entirely correct you have been giving files that are a huge pain in the ass to convert to a lowrance acceptable file. It's easier to just go make your own course trail with the barely marked trail.

Do you plan to improve this in 2016?

 

[NIKAL]

I would think for this new GPS Only format to work, AVE would have to offer the GPS files in both Lowrance & Garmin formats as you cant expect, nor should the racers have to convert AVE's GPS files to conform to the two most common GPS units being used. If they don't I could see some racers not wanting to race due to the added inconvenience.

Both versions should be e-mailed to the racer once their entry fee is payed, and also have it available at the race the day before, for any last minute entries or people who might have had issues downloading the e-mailed version. AVE should also have an experienced GPS person on hand to help and even install the maps on the racers GPS as this new GPS Only format is unlike any other series and they need to make sure that all their customers are taken care of at the highest level, if they don't want this to be a failure. Like Lou stated this might be a quick learning curve for those Stock & Sportsman racers who dont have prior GPS experience.

 

[XPirate]

To be entirely correct you have been giving files that are a huge pain in the ass to convert to a lowrance acceptable file. It's easier to just go make your own course trail with the barely marked trail.

Do you plan to improve this in 2016?

Never had a problem inserting the micro sd, and downloading the file... You seem to pick on this promoter a lot, and he is trying to provide an affordable and fun race series... yes, things can be improved and maybe with YOUR help, Lou's series will be better...

 

[george.felix]

Awesome idea! Anything that mixes it up can't be bad. I wish I was closer to race the series.

 

[ironworks]

Never had a problem inserting the micro sd, and downloading the file... You seem to pick on this promoter a lot, and he is trying to provide an affordable and fun race series... yes, things can be improved and maybe with YOUR help, Lou's series will be better...

Wow really. You should attend a BiTd race and see how much this lacks. It has potential to be great. Location and the fact it UTV only. I know at least a dozen or more people who refuse to race it because it's a circus.

Every time I have tired to assist it falls on deaf ears and many others tried the same. I get the lets go race in Mexico. Or let's have this or that when it takes hours to locate a guy on course trying to Bobbie trap and kill people at night in a station wagon on an 18 course or what ever it was.

This series could be a gold mine if the basics were focused on. Safety and course markings. BiTd marks the course awesome and gives an awesome gps file. And marks dangers that are on course.

I could go on and on if you need

 

[XPirate]

You don't have to go on and on, but you could possibly help. It's obvious that your constuctive criticism isn't working... maybe try volunteering to help mark the course or maybe use your vehicle and free time to plan and capture the course so we can all enjoy it. I too believe AVE could and should improve their series, but for most of the people, it's a "minor league" for a racing dream. I too was in one of the craziest races where the little desert dweller was running wrong way on the course, we also came upon a 7ft door stood upright, just over a crest... it sucks, but like in baja, you can't prevent the jackass' from being a jackass. You also can't rely on the promotor to keep you safe, we all would agree we dont want a nanny state, so why must he babysit you? Yes, safety standards should be checked, but in the end, nobody told you to drive above your abilities and wad your car up, Lou doesn't hold your gas pedal down, he doesn't make you barrel down the desert into an abandoned mine shaft, he surely doesn't intend to get anyone hurt... I believe his intention is to provide a less expensive experience that is as close to racing in baja as he sees...

 

[ironworks]

You don't have to go on and on, but you could possibly help. It's obvious that your constuctive criticism isn't working... maybe try volunteering to help mark the course or maybe use your vehicle and free time to plan and capture the course so we can all enjoy it. I too believe AVE could and should improve their series, but for most of the people, it's a "minor league" for a racing dream. I too was in one of the craziest races where the little desert dweller was running wrong way on the course, we also came upon a 7ft door stood upright, just over a crest... it sucks, but like in baja, you can't prevent the jackass' from being a jackass. You also can't rely on the promotor to keep you safe, we all would agree we dont want a nanny state, so why must he babysit you? Yes, safety standards should be checked, but in the end, nobody told you to drive above your abilities and wad your car up, Lou doesn't hold your gas pedal down, he doesn't make you barrel down the desert into an abandoned mine shaft, he surely doesn't intend to get anyone hurt... I believe his intention is to provide a less expensive experience that is as close to racing in baja as he sees...

The last 3 or so races I have done out there we have had to go out and make our own course map. Because no one else can make any sense of the course map. Its just easier to go out and take one lap and try to figure out wants going on. Then do another lap plotting our own course while taking notes. Then edit the course map a few times to get everything together.

The very first race I raced out there we were following a guy on out first lap with the GPS file in his dust there was a 3 foot speed bump right in the middle of the course. It was maked with a ribbon on each end of the berm to show you go over the berm and inbetween the ribbons. We win the dust we did not see any warnings or even the ribbons marking it until just a few feet before the berm. We rolled over on our lid and landed on the roof and then our wheels. There was no marking on the GPS file of any type of extreme danger or anything. No markings on course except to right on it.

I have heard it said from many racers that the course is marked by some one that has never ridden in a race car. If you mark the course like your driving in a jeep at 3mph its totally different then 40 mph. If you have raced out there you will understand.

The night the crazy meth heads or who ever was chasing people in his station wagon trying to go head on with racers on a race course. The problem that night is no one knew exactly where they were at on course. I believe I was one of the first people to a boobie trap on course. He had set up the cinder blocks across the road after a 90 degree turn. I told the guy at the next check point and he was clueless. Then on the next lap I saw all at the logs and a mattress in the road a few miles back from where the cinder blocks were. And at the same 90 degree turn the terrorist attempted to hit our car with the 2x4 pieces of wood. It took 3 laps for them to shut the race down because the course was so poorly marked. There wee zero course markers from mile 8 to like 28. The GPS file had none. I was later told they needed GPS points because all they knew was he was some where between mile marker 8 and 15 for like 2 hours. This kinda stuff is gonna happen when you race inside the city limits. What if that guy had hit some one head on in his car and they were seriously hurt? Would it take 2 hours to find them in the desert if there GPS was not working and they went off course at 11'o clock at night? Score and Bitd has precautions in place for these issues.

These 2 reasons are the whole reason its kinda funny to brag that AVE is gonna lead the way in the future of racing by having an all GPS file based race. When the last race I was in the GPS file he sends does not go straight into a Lowrance. I tried for 2 hours. The file I got translated was just a line in the desert. it was worthless.

If they are gonna do the GPS file like BITD. It will be awesome. BITD marks the course ever mile physically and on the GPS. They mark dangers that are not even dangerous. They do everything they can to make desert racing as safe as possible. Due to these issues and more I decided to go race BITD and see how much more the focus was on safety and course markings. I have tried to race a few races since and but the last one was a night mare with the rain.

Do you really think anyone went out and checked the course after the crazy rain storm before they let the races go back out at 6am Sunday. I guarantee they did not go out and check the course. Cognito was out prerunning late Saturday during the rainand said the sandy wash was under 2 of 3 ft of water.

The reason these issues are important is just like you said the it is a grass roots race and intended for beginners not seasoned pros. So rookies are not gonna know their GPS like a pro, They are racing Baja and so they are no expecting the crazies like you would have in BAJA. This is in the Calcity City limits. The safety tech should be even more then Baja or Bitd as the rookies don't know the obvious things a pro does.

 

[XPirate]

I agree with you whole heartily, I just was hoping instead of beating your head on a wall by ripping him apart, help him. You obviously have some pull with him, you got the "night" series changed to a day race because it fit you better... maybe you can help him mark the courses and understand the gps better... I am not the best at gps, nor do I seem to have all the free time you might, but if I did, I would be out there, it's close, its cheap, the series needs improvement and someone who is as passionate as you to help. You have been to the big leagues, why not help the small guy out, not just keyboard criticize...

 

[ironworks]

I agree with you whole heartily, I just was hoping instead of beating your head on a wall by ripping him apart, help him. You obviously have some pull with him, you got the "night" series changed to a day race because it fit you better... maybe you can help him mark the courses and understand the gps better... I am not the best at gps, nor do I seem to have all the free time you might, but if I did, I would be out there, it's close, its cheap, the series needs improvement and someone who is as passionate as you to help. You have been to the big leagues, why not help the small guy out, not just keyboard criticize...

Nothing was ever changed on anybody's account. Not sure what your saying about changing a night race to a day race. They still have a night race out there. I have a business to run and projects to complete. I might have some spare time when I die some day. I don't know much about GPS but I'm not a promoter so its not my job to know it like a promoter should. When I go to buy Dinner for my Family on a Friday night, I don't expect to have to go in their and show the cook how to not burn the food. I go in an pay the price on the menu for the food I want to eat. If food at a restaurant is not good they are not going to make much money. You can get away with alot of other things as long as the main reason they are open is fulfilled. I go desert race to have some one set up a create a fair and safe race I can compete on. This series doesn't need big awards, fancy banquets, or even a flat camp spot. It needs well laid courses that people want to race on, that are covered as safely as possible and ran well. Fun is just the icing on the cake that comes with the people the race. So far this series has made more BITD racers then people who have hung around. And this one is cheap, close and over some f the best terrain you can find. Cal City is a great place that is not blown out like most other places.

 

[lucho]

To be entirely correct you have been giving files that are a huge pain in the ass to convert to a lowrance acceptable file. It's easier to just go make your own course trail with the barely marked trail.

Do you plan to improve this in 2016?

Absolutely! I think what we plan on doing in 2016 is to provide you with the file at least ten days before the race. Of course, you will have to enter the event to get it but that way you will have plenty of time to convert it to your needs. You will also have the opportunity to take the "Virtual Tour" with the file before you head out to the desert, just to get familiar with the course and surrounding desert. If you would like to send me your email address, I can send you a more detailed outline as to why we had to do it. Send it to lou@averacing.com
Thanks.

 

[lucho]

To be entirely correct you have been giving files that are a huge pain in the ass to convert to a lowrance acceptable file. It's easier to just go make your own course trail with the barely marked trail.

Do you plan to improve this in 2016?

Also, we can put as much information as you want in the file, but remember, that as a promoter, I have to listen to everyone. I can't tell you how many racers came to me to delete a lot of the information off their file because they did not have room. Others worked it out fine.

I have a three-page outline explaining why we took these measures. We do not want to publish them in a public forum because we know that there are always a few "lurkers" who just want to screw with us. So if you are a racer with us, and we recognize your e-mail send us a request and we will be glad to send you all three pages.
If you are a first-timer with us, we will first vet you to make sure you are not one of them guys with a big badge, or a bunch of green shirts tailing you. Hey, you can't be all too careful nowadays.

 

[lucho]

The last 3 or so races I have done out there we have had to go out and make our own course map. Because no one else can make any sense of the course map. Its just easier to go out and take one lap and try to figure out wants going on. Then do another lap plotting our own course while taking notes. Then edit the course map a few times to get everything together.

The very first race I raced out there we were following a guy on out first lap with the GPS file in his dust there was a 3 foot speed bump right in the middle of the course. It was maked with a ribbon on each end of the berm to show you go over the berm and inbetween the ribbons. We win the dust we did not see any warnings or even the ribbons marking it until just a few feet before the berm. We rolled over on our lid and landed on the roof and then our wheels. There was no marking on the GPS file of any type of extreme danger or anything. No markings on course except to right on it.

I have heard it said from many racers that the course is marked by some one that has never ridden in a race car. If you mark the course like your driving in a jeep at 3mph its totally different then 40 mph. If you have raced out there you will understand.

The night the crazy meth heads or who ever was chasing people in his station wagon trying to go head on with racers on a race course. The problem that night is no one knew exactly where they were at on course. I believe I was one of the first people to a boobie trap on course. He had set up the cinder blocks across the road after a 90 degree turn. I told the guy at the next check point and he was clueless. Then on the next lap I saw all at the logs and a mattress in the road a few miles back from where the cinder blocks were. And at the same 90 degree turn the terrorist attempted to hit our car with the 2x4 pieces of wood. It took 3 laps for them to shut the race down because the course was so poorly marked. There wee zero course markers from mile 8 to like 28. The GPS file had none. I was later told they needed GPS points because all they knew was he was some where between mile marker 8 and 15 for like 2 hours. This kinda stuff is gonna happen when you race inside the city limits. What if that guy had hit some one head on in his car and they were seriously hurt? Would it take 2 hours to find them in the desert if there GPS was not working and they went off course at 11'o clock at night? Score and Bitd has precautions in place for these issues.

These 2 reasons are the whole reason its kinda funny to brag that AVE is gonna lead the way in the future of racing by having an all GPS file based race. When the last race I was in the GPS file he sends does not go straight into a Lowrance. I tried for 2 hours. The file I got translated was just a line in the desert. it was worthless.

If they are gonna do the GPS file like BITD. It will be awesome. BITD marks the course ever mile physically and on the GPS. They mark dangers that are not even dangerous. They do everything they can to make desert racing as safe as possible. Due to these issues and more I decided to go race BITD and see how much more the focus was on safety and course markings. I have tried to race a few races since and but the last one was a night mare with the rain.

Do you really think anyone went out and checked the course after the crazy rain storm before they let the races go back out at 6am Sunday. I guarantee they did not go out and check the course. Cognito was out prerunning late Saturday during the rainand said the sandy wash was under 2 of 3 ft of water.

The reason these issues are important is just like you said the it is a grass roots race and intended for beginners not seasoned pros. So rookies are not gonna know their GPS like a pro, They are racing Baja and so they are no expecting the crazies like you would have in BAJA. This is in the Calcity City limits. The safety tech should be even more then Baja or Bitd as the rookies don't know the obvious things a pro does.

Ironworks. Send me your e-mail and I'll be glad to answer some of your concerns. Lou

 

[lucho]

I would think for this new GPS Only format to work, AVE would have to offer the GPS files in both Lowrance & Garmin formats as you cant expect, nor should the racers have to convert AVE's GPS files to conform to the two most common GPS units being used. If they don't I could see some racers not wanting to race due to the added inconvenience....


Both versions should be e-mailed to the racer once their entry fee is paid, and also have it available at the race the day before, for any last minute entries or people who might have had issues downloading the e-mailed version. AVE should also have an experienced GPS person on hand to help and even install the maps on the racers GPS as this new GPS Only format is unlike any other series and they need to make sure that all their customers are taken care of at the highest level, if they don't want this to be a failure. Like Lou stated this might be a quick learning curve for those Stock & Sportsman racers who dont have prior GPS experience.

___________________________________________

Better yet, I will send the files to you as a "kml" file that you can open on your free Google Earth program, review it and then save it with the "extension" you need. We use GPS Visualizer to do all our conversions. It's also a free program. That way you can manipulate the file as you want it. You can delete stuff you might not need and can add stuff you want. With time, you can do a lot of things with the program so that when you come to pre-run you will have a pretty good idea as to the course, then all you have to do is add your comments and your markers to the existing file. You'll have the file at least ten days before the event.

Lastly, there will be limited course markers and only those who are signed up to race will receive those. This is to keep it away from people who seem intent to screw around with our courses. That's all.

Just so you'd know. We will probably spend at least three times more on the course than we would normally spend because we want to make sure we have the correct information. With the normal marking of the course, we mark it and then go over it again once.
This GPS-based course will take at least four to six times that we will physically review the course. Don't get me wrong, I love the fact that we can spend most of the day, away from phones, and just riding around. If anybody is interested in coming along, just let me know I'll put a few shrimp on the bar-b and let you know when. Hahaha!

 

[ironworks]

___________________________________________

Better yet, I will send the files to you as a "kml" file that you can open on your free Google Earth program, review it and then save it with the "extension" you need. We use GPS Visualizer to do all our conversions. It's also a free program. That way you can manipulate the file as you want it. You can delete stuff you might not need and can add stuff you want. With time, you can do a lot of things with the program so that when you come to pre-run you will have a pretty good idea as to the course, then all you have to do is add your comments and your markers to the existing file. You'll have the file at least ten days before the event.

Lastly, there will be limited course markers and only those who are signed up to race will receive those. This is to keep it away from people who seem intent to screw around with our courses. That's all.

Just so you'd know. We will probably spend at least three times more on the course than we would normally spend because we want to make sure we have the correct information. With the normal marking of the course, we mark it and then go over it again once.
This GPS-based course will take at least four to six times that we will physically review the course. Don't get me wrong, I love the fact that we can spend most of the day, away from phones, and just riding around. If anybody is interested in coming along, just let me know I'll put a few shrimp on the bar-b and let you know when. Hahaha!

How about just send a file ready to go into the lowrance. I don't know single person that has the time or interest to try and prerun on the Internet. It will less work to load it in my car and head to the desert to check it out first hand then play games trying to convert a Kml file. I have tried that quite a few times with other racer and it's just easier to go make our own course map.

 

[lucho]

How about just send a file ready to go into the lowrance. I don't know single person that has the time or interest to try and prerun on the Internet. It will less work to load it in my car and head to the desert to check it out first hand then play games trying to convert a Kml file. I have tried that quite a few times with other racer and it's just easier to go make our own course map.

That's not a problem when I save the race file, I can save it as an "usr" file as well. You may be one of the few who has no interest in downloading and seeing the file. I can't think of anyone racing with us that doesn't like to have it early enough to play around with it. You are right, the time to fool around with the file is not just before you start.

If I were you, I would sign up early and just look at the file when we send it to. Request a "usr" or an "klm" or both. Then convert it to your needs if you use our "kml" file, otherwise load up the ".usr" file. Preview it in your car and if everything seems OK, wait until you pre-run to make your own notes.
I would love to show you what I did for the Baja 1000. It took me several days to get what I wanted but if you are really serious about racing and winning, this is what you have to. Send me your e-mail address and I will attach the "kml" file that can be viewed in Google Earth. I can't do through this forum.